[SML] Smoke vs Heat vs Rate of Rise detectors
Riter, Andrew
andrew.riter at ubc.ca
Tue Mar 8 21:09:51 UTC 2022
Thanks to Bill Jim Dale George and Bruce
Project is on the books, but the process hasn't started yet (no one assigned to manage it).
I expect that experts will be hired, but I need to know what to demand before we meet with them, so we can argue in our favour.
We've always had issues with the Fire Announce Mic system, and during some testing, it appears its amp failed. Research by facilities determined that the system (made by 1 of the top 3 lines) isn't repairable anymore. And since the systems have changed slightly in the past 25 years, it's not just a matter of replacing the Main Panel, but every sensor, pull station, Refuge Phone etc.
Sprinklers are fine. (the heads have been replaced twice in my 20 years: once as an upgrade, and then a year later either as a warranty or similar issue).
We're in the Pacific North West (OK Canada, so South West). Winters aren't that bad.
The FOH Cove (enclosed room in the ceiling for the lighting; not open catwalk) does get up to 40deg C during graduation season (they stay on for 12 hours straight), but that's a slow increase, so shouldn't be a big deal.
Different venue on campus just replaced the deluge curtain with a fire curtain after the inevitable occurred. The Mist Heads seem interesting, but we won't be doing that.
Thanks for the comments.
Andrew M. Riter
Chan Centre
604-808-2033 (working from home)
-----Original Message-----
From: Stagecraft <stagecraft-bounces at theatrical.net> On Behalf Of Dale Farmer via Stagecraft
Sent: Monday, March 7, 2022 6:09 PM
To: stagecraft at theatrical.net
Cc: Dale Farmer <dale at cybercom.net>
Subject: Re: [SML] Smoke vs Heat vs Rate of Rise detectors
[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]
Caveat. I have not kept up with current technology in fire detection systems.
Beam detectors have their place, but not any place that is likely to have helium balloons. You really want to have a way to shut them off
for special events. You want to consult with a locally licensed fire
protection engineer and spend the bucks and the time to educate them on the special aspects of theater. Local codes will have great influence.
Make friends with your local fire inspector and ask for advice.
Finding one who already understands theaters is a pearl of great rarity.
Also, why does the university insist your existing system needs to be
replaced? Is it broken? Did the insurance carrier inspector say so?
Presumably the existing system was legal when installed and likely grandfathered in.
plain heat detectors are cheap and reliable. They are literally a disk of metal or glass ampule that melts or bursts at a set temperature to
activate an alarm. My big issue with rate of rise detectors is that if
you have serious winter at your location, they also detect that you just closed the door to the outside, and as the heating system warms the place up, they go off. Rate of rise detectors will alarm faster than the heat detectors in a fire situation.
Sprinkler systems are a wonderful thing. Also, if there is money for
sprinkler system upgrade, take a real close look at those micro fine water mist systems. They are catching on in europe, on ships, and the
hotel industry. Basically they spray out distilled water at high
pressure to create a mist or fog. This mist of micro droplets stay in the air for a long time, and as the fire sucks in air to burn the fuel,
the mist gets sucked in with it and extinguishes the fire. The
advantage is they use about ten percent of the water compared to a conventional sprinkler system. This greatly reduces the amount of water damage. Cleanup uses rags and wet vacs instead of pumps and shovels.
The other large advantage is the distilled water mist works on A, B, and C fires, and can be used on energized electrical equipment.
Dale
On 3/7/2022 8:28 PM, Bill Conner via Stagecraft wrote:
> Most modern heat detectors are both rate of rise and fixed temp, so just
> avoid particle (smoke). (In US, no option in return air other than
> particle. Am working on a code change to fix that.) I've not formed a
> strong opinion on the beam detectors. Had one that shot across a
> catwalk. Move past that point fast and no problem, but stop a second and
> alarm activates. Another project helium balloons in house set it off.
> But maybe with thought on placement they'd be OK.
>
> On Mon, Mar 7, 2022, 7:29 PM Riter, Andrew via Stagecraft
> <stagecraft at theatrical.net <mailto:stagecraft at theatrical.net>> wrote:
>
> The university has said our entire fire alarm system needs to be
> upgraded.____
>
> __ __
>
> When designed in the late 90s (opened in 1997), the designers put
> heat detectors in the venues, but missed the “shared” areas that
> look like separate rooms on the drawings but actually share the same
> air (they put smoke detectors in the pit, Front of House Cove, venue
> light locks, and air return system).____
>
> __ __
>
> I’d love to take this opportunity to replace a bunch of the smoke
> detectors with Heat detectors, but I believe there is a difference
> between Rate of Rise detectors and “set off at x degree level of
> heat” detectors.____
>
> __ __
>
> Can anyone give me a quick primer on these types of heat detectors,
> and advantages / disadvantages of each?____
>
> __ __
>
> Thanks everyone.____
>
> __ __
>
> *Andrew M. Riter*
> Assistant Technical Director, Head Lighting Technician
> Chan Centre for the Performing Arts
> The University of British Columbia | Vancouver Campus
> 6265 Crescent Road | Vancouver BC | V6T 1Z1 Canada
> Phone 604 822 2372
> andrew.riter at ubc.ca <mailto:andrew.riter at ubc.ca>____
>
> UBC E-mail Signature____
>
> __ __
>
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